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Kevin Smith... Hurm...

 
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James Brophy



Joined: 22 Apr 2004
Posts: 64
Location: Dublin
PostPosted: Fri 27-Jan-2006 2:21 pm    Post subject: Kevin Smith... Hurm... Reply with quote

Have you seen that daredevil dvd doccumentary about the artists and writers?

They all come off in diffrent in intresting ways. Stan Lee is his usual EVERYTHINGS GREAT! but really quite humble about it all. Bendis looks professional and anoyed when the writing isint being serviced in a book. Miller seems kind of oddly aroused by the whole dardevil pulp hero motif. I dont know how many times he says the words Sexy and Dark but, it's alot.

When you get to Kevin Smith though, he's like a rabbit in the headlights. He's apollogising or the story he wrote all over the place. Joe Quesadda is putting forward the virtues of it and making a great case for DD in generall but Smith is reeling from criticisim for a book he wrote... How many years back?

Is it just me or is Smith scared to death of writing a big story?

When he got daredevil he resorted to writing a major charicter death. He just assumed that people dident care about Karen Page any more. She has just as many scars, if not more, as Matt. Shurely some writer could have found a way of bringing her back.

It was a well written little slice of life in the marvel style, but compaired to Bendis, Miller or Mack he is sutch a week writer overall. He says he's informed by his religion but it really comes across more like it's getting in the way of his story.

Most depressing though was that he couldent even resist his standard refrence set of Star Wars, Jaws and Jay and Silent Bob.

Well give him alot of slack because he's percived to be one of us, a comics fan who made it. But I'm starting to think he's just a comics fan and not much of a writer.

Am I wrong? Over critical? Come on, let's fight! Razz

Mabye I'm just bitter, I'm still waiting on my second issue of Daredevil: Target. Wink

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Chip Livingstone


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PostPosted: Sat 28-Jan-2006 1:37 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

>We'll give him a lot of slack because he's percived to be one of us...
A point well made, I am/was a big KS fan, but recently he has been a little down on the creative side.
A couple of weeks ago KS turned up in an ep of Joey ( the Friends spin-off ) playing himself and it was nothing like the KS I got to know on his yak-tracks and interviews.
Now, really, would one of us appear in that show?
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James Brophy



Joined: 22 Apr 2004
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PostPosted: Sat 28-Jan-2006 2:12 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Only thing that could make it worse is if he was playing with a star wars transformer.

Very Happy

Damn, a guest spot on Joey? Yeah, THATS going to up your credability on the indi movie circut.

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Chip Livingstone


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PostPosted: Thu 02-Feb-2006 2:52 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

That thing that is said about Kevin Smith, about how he is informed by his religion. This has come up time and again, he gives the impression that he comes from a Roman Catholic background. I have no reason to doubt him but I must question how exactly he is 'informed by his religion'

Consider the movie Dogma. It is only Roman Catholic in the sense that it has two angels who have been banished from Heaven and The Metatron who speaks for God. Everything else in the movie is pure fantasy, fantasy in this context is everything that is outside the RC religion.
Smith mixs all sorts of myths and legends into the storyline, Greek, Norse, New Age, etc and we must give him credit for having a secret Bloodline of Christ before that Da Vinci Code nonsense.

I love Dogma, I love Buddy Christ and the whole crazy tour around the Earth's belief systems. But it is not informed by his religion, it is not a Roman Catholic movie.
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James Brophy



Joined: 22 Apr 2004
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PostPosted: Thu 02-Feb-2006 10:40 am    Post subject: Da Vinchi Dogma Reply with quote

I enjoyed Dogma too, but it's not That origional.

The secret bloodline of christ was in Preacher before the Da Vinchi Code. Before all of these was the source of the christ bloodline idea...

The book Holy Blood, Holy Grail.
http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/0440136482/002-0639276-7884006?v=glance&n=283155

The book was origionally presented as fact, so most writers who go with the idea end up taking elements directly from the book, like jesus taking a wife, the priory of scion and the idea that the whole mystery can be explained through the investigation of one village in the south of france.
(Which, I belive, is the book's first line.)

It has of course been rubished, now that people have investigated it's claims. The origional authors have admitted that it was untrue. That dosen't stop people who think it's a good yarn.

...And why should it. Smile

One of the authors was a noted french sureliest during the 70's.
(That's from the doccumentary, the real Da Vinchi code on Channel 4)
So the same movement that gave us monthy python and the holy grail gives us this. Fun Eh? Very Happy

For more on the conspiracy theories of this ilk...
http://www.disinfo.com/archive/pages/dossier/id96/pg1/

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Killer Bob



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PostPosted: Tue 07-Feb-2006 2:22 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I'd have to say, as someone from a very not Roman Catholic background, that Dogma is very RC "informed" to me. The whole background/mythology is RC rather than Protestant or Orthodox, let alone Jewish, Islamic, etc.

Perhaps it is harder to spot from the inside? Or perhaps you are partially correct and it just seems to be RC to me from the outside?

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Chip Livingstone


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PostPosted: Wed 08-Feb-2006 1:50 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

That's exactly what makes it such a damn good movie, viewers can believe in it and be carried along by the story. Within the univerese of the film it makes good sense and has a logic of it's own. Kevin Smith crafted together a number of elements from all sorts of sources and made them into a unique movie.
I do not wish to destroy anyone's enjoyment of this film, it is very good and stands up to repeated viewing.

But I was born and breed as a RC and I see Dogma as it is.
Loki is not one of us, God cannot be sucker-punched by minor demons, there does not have to be a secret bloodline of Christ, His will can make itself known at any time.
If you cut a dogs tail off, can you say it is now a pig? No, you can't. If an Angel cuts off it's wings, is it Human? No it is not. they are two different kinds of creatures.

Wow listen to me ranting on about God and such like. Considering what is going on around the world right now, I can't go on with this right now. Sorry for being such a pussy. believe anything , I am staying out of it.
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Chip Livingstone


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PostPosted: Sun 12-Feb-2006 3:01 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

On the other hand I watched an ep of Family Guy tonight, it was about Xmas and taking down crazed housewifes and why Santa needs so many hidden cameras.
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Chip Livingstone


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PostPosted: Sun 12-Feb-2006 3:03 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Is anyone else outraged, shall we go into the streets and burn it all into the ground?
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underdog



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PostPosted: Wed 22-Feb-2006 9:01 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Sure, why not? I haven't been in a good mob for a while.
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Jumbo



Joined: 21 Apr 2004
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PostPosted: Thu 23-Feb-2006 10:21 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I dont really grade a writer by how they come acros on a DVD.

Often I have met writers, whom, for one reason or another, have left me thinking they were idiots, and that has influenced my readin, but that was after personal encounters.

I enjoyed smiths run on Daredevil. I think comparing him to Bendis, is like comparing Bendis to Alan Moore, its not a fair comparison.

At teh moment, there must be about 50+ marvel titles, I read about a half dozen of those, in comic and GN format. There a lot of comics I dont read, because I think they are crap.

Millar, Bendis and Mack, who you quote, are all writers I would read. I would also read Smith, JMS, Ennis, Milligan.

But that list is such a small part of the total writers list that Marvel has working for them. Sure, they are teh heavy hitters, and I think that Smith may not be as good as some of those guys, on certain days, but all have produced bad works in their own right.

Whats Smith currently working on?

I think that saying someone is afaid of teh BIG STORY is a bit rich. Comics have BIG STORIES every six months, or something cataclysmic that hopefully embues a sudden rush of excitement into readers, which increases sales.

Should I read Avengers dissasembled because:

Beginning this summer, the House of Ideas will unveil an event that will rock the entirety of the Marvel Universe: Avengers Disassembled!

actually I think not. I havent read it, dont need to, it didnt rock the marvel titles I was reading and the New Avengers is a grand story thanks, although I am unsure if it makes the whole dissasebled thing look a bit silly, as they re-assemble.

Sure its an interesting tactic, as oppossed to just stopping and restarting, and of course Bendis can point to reasons, and oppurtunities teh 'dissasembled' story gives him, but surely its lead to The New Avengers being Good comics, rather than rocking the entire marvel universe.

Of course, perhaps fan reaction was bad about Karen Pae, which is just silly, as anyone knows she can always be reanimated by a zombie or something...

I liked his daredevil run.

james
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James Brophy



Joined: 22 Apr 2004
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PostPosted: Fri 24-Feb-2006 9:37 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

But it's not just the dvd thing.

It's doing first issues of, not one, but TWO new titles and not getting to issue two. That's the kind of track record you expect out of some guy who photocoppies his own and delivers them to the shops.

Quote:
"I think comparing him to Bendis, is like comparing Bendis to Alan Moore, its not a fair comparison. "

Alan moore is fair game, Bendis is fair game and Smith is writing and picking up a paycheck so I get to do the clasic fan thing and talk about the worth a man I never met on a message bord. Laughing

My problem lies with the people who put him up there as a great writer in the same league as Bendis. I'm reading his stuff, I'm watching his movies and it's all fairly average stuff.

ok...
Quote:
I think that saying someone is afaid of teh BIG STORY is a bit rich.

Have you watched the dvd i'm talking about?

Just find the bit with Smith and the bit with Joe Q and you will understand what I'm talking about. This is not the only point of my areguement; But it is a rather good rosetta stone by whitch the rest of his actions are revealed.

Mabye I should clarrify what I mean by big story. I mean a story important to the writer and the reader. Not marketing Bollox.

To him that's clearly every marvel story he writes. (dvd shows this)

One of the most intimidating things I can think of is following a sucess with a sequel. I say that he is overwealmed by this and therefore has had to go away and pluck up some courage to come back to finish his two books.

Though with the current situation in the daredevil books I dont know where (or rather when) this story is supposed to be set.

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Jumbo



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PostPosted: Fri 24-Feb-2006 9:49 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Perhaps he is a bit crap, and perhaps he isnt as good as bendis, both things are quite possible, and even true.

I havent seen teh DVD t be honest, but I rate a writer by the comics, mostly. I enjoyed his draedevil run.

I looked at his bibiliography, and he hasnt done that much, to get him rated at the level of Bendis, so I wonder who is making such a comparison that you disagree with.

Apart from Daredevil and Green Arrow, 4 odd years ago, he hasnt really anything amazing to show.

In saying that I rate him, and would buy DD or some other comic that he was writing.

Of course, this may be the problem, or may be his problem, who knows.

I think if he were to have a 'big story' the marketing etc would be huge, thats actually how it works, I wonder if Joe and Co. are sitting round waiting for him to come up with the goods.

I also think you wil find that many stories in comics ae both important to the writer, and also teh reader, but not all readers.

J
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